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-   -   Clutch slip? (http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33114)

Ebenezer 06-21-2011 09:10 PM

Clutch slip?
 
If I am doing 65-70 in 5th gear and can it, my RPM's jump but it take a bit for the bike to get up to speed. Is this just the clutch slipping, and if so, where is my best bet to start? A simple adjustment, or do I need to dig deeper?

petejw 06-21-2011 09:13 PM

hi Ebenezer,
theres a cpl of adj for the clutch u can try,
one at the handle bars the other on the right side cover
where the cable goes into,
also engine oil plays a big part of it as well, what type
of engine oil are u using.

Ebenezer 06-21-2011 09:18 PM

The PO used 20-50 Valvoline, so I stuck with that. I have adjusted the cable at the handlebars, but it didn't seem to make a difference.

motoman 06-21-2011 09:19 PM

Adjustment FIRST behind the clutch cover, then at the cable. Specifics for that are I believe in the tech. tips. That doesn't do it, then clutch spring replacement MAY be in order. Just a hint if changing springs....EBC's are junk,IMO from many years of motoX racing. Barrnet springs ARE the way to go.....also, IMO, do NOT add an extra steel plate to the mix......changes a WHOLE lot of things besides dimensions, and is a band-aid at best. Have seen to many things go array in the moto-X world with some doing this......and those clutches take WAY more abuse than on the street, so issues that I 've sen show up in that world WILL eventually show up in the street world.....sooner or later.....again, welcome to the insanity!

petejw 06-21-2011 09:27 PM

i did a search but couldnt find anything for u,

as motorman stated, do the adj behind the clutch cover first,
loosen the cable at the handle bars,
remove the side cover that the clutch cable goes into,
loosen the lock nut, and turn the adj screw in til its lightly seated
against the pressure plate, back the scew out a quarter of a turn then
tighten the lock nut.
then adj free play at the handle bars.

if that doesnt fix the slippage then u'l have to pull the clutch assy apart
and check for spring wear and friction plate thickness.

with the engine oil it wants to be SG api rated, itl be written on the container somewhere.

motoman 06-21-2011 10:02 PM

Thanks Petejw.......could'nt remember rite-off the free-play setting for that as it's been a couple years since I'd checked or done mine.

James England 06-22-2011 04:43 AM

Mine did that when I first bought it, especially with a passenger on the bike. I replaced the clutch fibre plates and lightly sandpapered the metal plates (which get covered in a kind of burned-on glaze from the oil/friction etc. I replaced the clutch springs with 10% stronger springs. Whilst I was at it, I filed flat all the worn bits on the clutch basket and outer housing (they get little grooves in from wear).

Also, whilst you're in there, I'd replace the clutch release bearing that's on the inside of the clutch 'spider'. They are about $5 and well worth replacing. I lost a slight rumble that was there when I pulled in the clutch, after fitting the new one.

Check the three ball bearings which live in a traingular plate under the clutch release mechanism. The top ball can get rusty with emulsified oil sitting on it. They are 10mm chromed steel balls and cost next to nothing. If the chrome on yours is pitted or worn, replace them.

Having done that, my clutch has never slipped since.

WMarshy 06-22-2011 06:40 AM

Check here to see how people fixed their clutch slip...

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26942

BA80 06-22-2011 07:07 AM

Ebenezer, as stated the oil being used makes a great deal of difference when it comes to clutch slippage. Be SURE it's formulated to run with these older wet clutches. A lot of the modern formulas use friction modifiers that don't play well with these old clutches. Just because that's what the PO used dosn't mean it's the right stuff. I use Castrol 4T 20w50 motorcycle oil and it works well. A little more expensive at about $3 a quart but worth it.

Also, the Barnett heavy duty springs are usually all you need if the oil doesn't do the trick. These clutch discs hardley ever wear out unless they've been heavily abused. A new set of springs only runs about $30 shipped and are quite easily changed on the sidestand without even draining the oil. About an hours worth of work.

Here's the link for new springs......

http://www.phatperformanceparts.com/...14&Search.y=10

Ebenezer 06-23-2011 08:03 PM

Thanks. I adjusted the clutch again to no avail, so I ordered the springs and will try a different oil also. Anything tips when changing the springs?

BA80 06-23-2011 08:41 PM

Be careful with the aluminum star plate that holds the springs down, they break easily if not tightened evenly.

Fit the star on there without the springs and you will see that there is a sort of piston that fits into a cylynder in the middle. The tolerences are pretty close so it will bind and cause the ears to break off the star if not tightened evenly.

Also, WMarshy posted in this thread http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26942&page=2 , post #30, that the bolts can streach and break. Check the bolts.

WMarshy 06-24-2011 09:41 AM

I also started a post on the bolt fatigue here...

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...hlight=Fatigue

Also, this tech tip has the full disassembly of the clutch incase you need more info...

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9481

Good luck! Let us know how it comes out.

Ebenezer 06-24-2011 06:22 PM

My parts won't be in until next week. Is there anything else I might want to replace when I have this thing opened up?

BA80 06-24-2011 06:26 PM

Not much of anything else in there bro'.;) Just clutch

bikerphil 06-25-2011 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ebenezer (Post 330959)
My parts won't be in until next week. Is there anything else I might want to replace when I have this thing opened up?

If your frictions are on the lower end of the wear tolerance, you can add an extra steel plate in the center of the pack. I just did one today like that with new springs, haven't tested it though, been raining. Lever's nice and stiff though.

James England 06-25-2011 02:18 AM

If you're in there, replace the friction plates anyway. Also replace the clutch release bearing. Well worth doing

BA80 06-25-2011 06:14 AM

You could replace the friction plates but you might want to measure them first. Very rarely do I hear of them being below specs.

The bearing might be a good idea, however, I have only heard of one of those ever going bad. It was destroyed by someone who at one time or another has destroyed nearly every part of his XJ. ;)

No sense in wasting money unecessarily. IMHO

Ebenezer 06-26-2011 08:22 PM

After reading a few other threads I decided the clutch cable should be replaced as well. That showed up yesterday, so I changed that out this afternoon. Perfect! No more slip. The old one was pretty gummed up. I now see the importance of lubing it. I still plan to replace the springs when I get a chance. Thanks again for all your input.

Nubian 06-28-2011 09:46 AM

I just changed over my handle bar to a sportier one lots of excess cable length everywhere. I immediately noticed the slipped clutch sensation. Is this a classic symptom that appears when you relocate the clutch lever?

natemoen 06-28-2011 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nubian (Post 331472)
I just changed over my handle bar to a sportier one lots of excess cable length everywhere. I immediately noticed the slipped clutch sensation. Is this a classic symptom that appears when you relocate the clutch lever?

If you have a lot of excess unsecured cable it can allow the cable to move instead of the cable moving the arm that actuates the clutch mechanism.

Ebenezer 07-07-2011 05:10 PM

I went to put in the barnett springs today that I ordered off a link from one of these threads, and either I goofed, or they sent the wrong ones. Does any one have the part number for springs for an 81 special? I had ordered them from phat performance.

WMarshy 07-07-2011 07:20 PM

These are the ones I ordered... # 501-58-06045
http://www.phatperformanceparts.com/...14&Search.y=10

Ebenezer 07-07-2011 10:12 PM

Those are the ones I got. They measure 2 1/4". Is that correct? Is that what makes them heavier duty? Or am I just going to break that plate tightening them? The manual specs the springs at just over 1.6". I've never worked on a clutch before, so please forgive my ignorance.

WMarshy 07-08-2011 03:12 AM

That doesn't seem right, mine were only 1-11/16" long. Take a look at this link...
http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...hlight=barnett

TomRodgers 07-08-2011 06:41 AM

clutch slip or fuel....
 
not to hijack the thread....

but since a lot of you posted.....here is my issue...
Sunshine launches fine and pulls hard at almost every speed. im guessing i have a fuel problem, rather than a clutch issue.....

Cruising around at 55-65 mph, if i twist it hard, jets up to 75-80 with no problem, then gets this "hesitation" then pulls like a beast again until speedo is pegged....tach to about 7000. This hesitation comes around in 5th gear and approx 6000_6500 rpms....

Any thoughts???

WMarshy 07-08-2011 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TomRodgers (Post 332785)
not to hijack the thread....

but since a lot of you posted.....here is my issue...
Sunshine launches fine and pulls hard at almost every speed. im guessing i have a fuel problem, rather than a clutch issue.....

Cruising around at 55-65 mph, if i twist it hard, jets up to 75-80 with no problem, then gets this "hesitation" then pulls like a beast again until speedo is pegged....tach to about 7000. This hesitation comes around in 5th gear and approx 6000_6500 rpms....

Any thoughts???

Next time you have the carbs out and apart take a close look at the diaphrams. You might have a pin hole, not allowing a slide or slides to lift in sync with the other cylinders. Unlikely but JAT... Otherwise, you might want to kill the engine at that RPM when it acts up and let it coast to a stop and read the mixture on your plugs. Have you checked the timing at all?

Ebenezer 07-08-2011 07:23 AM

Yeah, I checked again. The part number is the same as the one you listed. The springs are 2 1/4" inches long. And the bolts are longer than the ones I took out as well. I guess I'll have to make a call. Thanks.

WMarshy 07-08-2011 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ebenezer (Post 332790)
Yeah, I checked again. The part number is the same as the one you listed. The springs are 2 1/4" inches long. And the bolts are longer than the ones I took out as well. I guess I'll have to make a call. Thanks.

I still have the Barnett box the new springs came in, I will check it when I get home. Probably wont be until 7...

Ebenezer 07-08-2011 11:48 AM

The sticker/part number on the outside of the package is right, but the sticker/part number on the inside insert is wrong. Their screw up, not mine.

BA80 07-08-2011 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ebenezer (Post 332790)
Yeah, I checked again. The part number is the same as the one you listed. The springs are 2 1/4" inches long. And the bolts are longer than the ones I took out as well. I guess I'll have to make a call. Thanks.


That's the # listed for 78-81 XS1100.....

http://www.barnettclutches.com/produ...clutch_cc=1100

Yours came with bolts? All I got was springs.:confused:

WMarshy 07-08-2011 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BA80 (Post 332834)
That's the # listed for 78-81 XS1100.....

http://www.barnettclutches.com/produ...clutch_cc=1100

Yours came with bolts? All I got was springs.:confused:

Yeah, whats up with that!? I recently found out that the 6 bolts can become fatigued and break near the head! :eek: Read more here...

http://www.xs11.com/forum/showthread...t=Bolt+fatigue

oops, already posted it...:rolleyes:

BA80 07-08-2011 03:00 PM

Yeah, I read that Wade.;)

Ebenezer 07-08-2011 03:23 PM

Yeah, this package came with washers and bolts. Phat is working on getting me the right ones. I put the old springs back in for now and snapped the head off one of the bolts, imagine that. So I went and got 6 new bolts. Clutch still slips in 5th. Not a huge problem if I take it easy, but we'll see what happens when I get the right springs.

Ebenezer 08-05-2011 07:55 PM

Finally got the right springs, at least I hope so. Going to put them in this weekend. Also got the release bearing. Any tips on putting in the new bearing/taking out the old one?

mack 08-05-2011 10:28 PM

clutch release
 
Here is the mechanism disassembled from right to left. The bearings are on the triangle plate.

http://i946.photobucket.com/albums/a...5/P7130008.jpg

Ebenezer 08-06-2011 06:58 AM

Not the ball bearings. The clutch release bearing.

Ebenezer 08-07-2011 07:40 AM

Put the springs in last night. Took it for a ride this morning and no more slippage! Thanks for all your help again.

Bellerophon 08-07-2011 08:02 AM

This is great news. Glad you got it figured out.


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